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Occasional Contributor
Posts: 28
Registered: ‎29-09-2016

Re: What do you think of the new ESMA proposals?

Great wise words Casynotes thank you. My risk and rewards are very set in place.

 

I take it you did the same type of strategy start small and build up? 

He Is the thing Esma is now forcing that upon us?  And you are so right the account will take a long time to build with trades due to high margins.

 

I think Ig know they have lost the battle with Esma, as this would hit the company hard will they survive now?

 

Trev.

 

 

Occasional Contributor
Posts: 28
Registered: ‎29-09-2016

Re: What do you think of the new ESMA proposals?

Hi me again,

 

When you say the execution of trades is not as smooth, there is slippage when going live. I do not get that from the demo platform,,,,is there a difference to the live platform then?

Trev

Occasional Contributor
Posts: 28
Registered: ‎29-09-2016

Re: What do you think of the new ESMA proposals?

Hi Rich,

 

I was looking at there site today. So you can say all good and safe? I did ask them to ring me today so I can set up a demo account before going live as it will take time to get used to there platform.

Are you trading with IC Markets Rich?

 

It's a damn shame that these margins have going to the stars I don't want to leave IG but can't do these silly margins which will be enforced upon us!

 

Trev. 

Esteemed Contributor
Posts: 2,277
Registered: ‎10-03-2016

Re: What do you think of the new ESMA proposals?

Hi @Trevbeats, yes there is a difference between live and demo, demo executes quickly and cleanly with no slippage but the real world is not like that, just as it took time to get to grips with demo you will need to start again to learn the live which is why I said in the PM go back to min size to start live.

 

As I said, ESMA is 3 month trial and the FCA expect to be consulted before anything permanent, I would suggest to use that time learning live on minimum (which is within the esma margin) and see what developes. Then start to think about shifting to size up (if  you are still confident to do so). 

Frequent Contributor
Posts: 64
Registered: ‎08-03-2016

Re: What do you think of the new ESMA proposals?

"Next steps ESMA intends to adopt these measures in the official languages of the EU in the coming weeks, following which ESMA will publish an official notice on its website. The measures will then be published in the Official Journal of the EU (OJ) and will start to apply one month, for binary options, and two months, for CFDs, after their publication in the OJ."

 

maybe wait and see whats happen before we move down under?

 

i wonder if it was fca that made IG change the margin calculation when using guaranteed stops?

 

its strange that you need a 600 margin on a 60 point guaranteed stop (dax 12 000)

 

 

 

 

 

 

Occasional Contributor
Posts: 28
Registered: ‎29-09-2016

Re: What do you think of the new ESMA proposals?

If we did move down under like you say, would you recommend ICMarkets, seems to be the next best thing to IG as it looks a safe bet to trade with?

 

I can't see why we can not use the overseas IG's?

 

Trev

Regular Contributor
Posts: 206
Registered: ‎22-02-2018

Re: What do you think of the new ESMA proposals?

 
Occasional Contributor
Posts: 28
Registered: ‎29-09-2016

Re: What do you think of the new ESMA proposals?

Ok thank you,

 

Wow, I bet this can cause frustration when executing trades. Slippage I have not actually seen as yet? I might have seen a couple of times candles jump and leave a gap, is that slippage Casy?

 

As for executing this means for sell and buy? So when you are about to sell or buy, it does not do in that second?

Sorry for the questions on this but it's new to me like you say.     

Occasional Contributor
Posts: 28
Registered: ‎29-09-2016

Re: What do you think of the new ESMA proposals?

It's ridiculous PF 

 

I have been Informed it's a 3-month trial? and Why?

Esteemed Contributor
Posts: 2,277
Registered: ‎10-03-2016

Re: What do you think of the new ESMA proposals?

@Trevbeats, yes gaps are slippage but a gap might also be a single large candle. If you have a stop loss order price may jump over it with the order not being executed until the next offered price, on excitable pairs such as GBPJPY or any pair on a news event that can easily be 20 points away, yes there are guaranteed stops but are they worth it in the long run if you know what you are doing? You will only find out by doing the math.

 

The point being that going live is not the end of the learning curve not least because demo can't be exactly like live. 

 

 

Occasional Contributor
Posts: 5
Registered: ‎01-04-2018

Re: What do you think of the new ESMA proposals?

[ Edited ]

@Trevbeats, I've not used [mod edit - removed for breach of terms of service. Please see this post for more information.] yet. Was just carrying out my initial investigations and checking that someone in the UK could set up an account with them without the need to be resident in Australia or require an Australian domestic bank account. This is all fine. I looked at [mod edit - removed for breach of terms of service. Please see this post for more information.] because I know someone in Australia who recommended them so they are my initial choice for when I decide to move. Going to set up a small account with them over the next couple of weeks (ie, before July) just to check out how things work with them and then if I'm happy will move across wholesale in July, assuming ESMA go ahead with their leverage/margin changes.

Senior Member
Posts: 1
Registered: ‎17-11-2017

Re: What do you think of the new ESMA proposals?

[ Edited ]

Hi Rich,

 

Same for me here in The Netherlands.

I want to stay with IG, because I like there professionalism and support, but also find it strange that IG is not going "the full monty" at ESMA to protect our retail trading. What are there next steps ? Sue ESMA to show them that you cannot ignore the 98% against numbers ?

 

IG Swiss or IG Australia would be my preference, but the mentioned [mod edit - removed for breach of terms of service. Please see this post for more information.] looks very promising and is also on my short list. 

 

Regards,

John.

Regular Contributor
Posts: 210
Registered: ‎04-06-2016

Re: What do you think of the new ESMA proposals?

would be useful if IG could reduce their minimum position sizes   or introduce more options - particularly on shares

Occasional Visitor
Posts: 1
Registered: ‎18-10-2016

Re: What do you think of the new ESMA proposals?

Good idea- IG can you reduce the best sizes on shares and commodities to 10p a point?

 

 

Community Manager
Posts: 1,154
Registered: ‎20-09-2016

Re: What do you think of the new ESMA proposals?

Hi all. There have been a few more questions regarding ESMA so I wanted to take the time to address some of those now. As before, please do not take the following as an official statement from IG, but rather read it in the medium in which it is presented – a forum reply to your questions.

 

 

On what happens next…

As previously stated by a Community member, an official ESMA press release ‘next steps’ stated that: “ESMA intends to adopt these measures in the official languages of the EU in the coming weeks, following which ESMA will publish an official notice on its website.  The measures will then be published in the Official Journal of the EU (OJ) and will start to apply one month, for binary options, and two months, for CFDs, after their publication in the OJ.”

 

The main take away from this is that we have some time before these measures come into force. An email communication from IG was sent to the full client base on the 29th of March stating that we expect this to be July, but please let me know if you haven’t seen this and I can get it sent out again.

 

I would like to reiterate that at present exact date is unknown, and IG may make the decision to make any changes earlier than required. This will of course be communicated to clients.

 

Finally, I also wanted to note one Community member’s question about the future financial stability of the IG Group in light of these regulatory changes. As we set out in our RNS issued last week, we expect these new rules to have some impact on our revenue, but we expect to remain the strongest and most stable CFD provider in the World.

 

 

On the impact on new or old positions…

In the above ESMA link under the ‘CFDs – agreed measures, section one’ they note that “Leverage limits on the opening of a position by a retail client from…” which we take to mean this will only have an effect on the opening of new positions. This therefore shouldn’t impact existing trades, however we are looking to confirm this.

 

 

In regards to the ‘three month’ query…

A couple of posts in this thread have noted a slight confusion over the length of time these measures will be imposed. The press release stated that “In accordance with MiFIR, ESMA can only introduce temporary intervention measures on a three monthly basis. Before the end of the three months, ESMA will consider the need to extend the intervention measures for a further three months.” We don’t know for sure, but we think ESMA will extend the time period for these rules at least a couple of times before national regulators like the FCA update their own rules to be more like ESMA’s new rules.

 

 

On what IG is doing in regards to the ESMA ruling…

When the ESMA ruling first came out we issued an RNS response which may be worth a read if you haven’t already. As a global leader in online trading for CFD and Spread Betting clients we have considerable resources at our disposal which we can prioritise to matters such as this. We have a good relationship with the regulators and will continue talks with the bodies we are regulated by, both going into and after the ESMA follow up over the coming months.

 

We are reviewing all available options to see what course of action is the most appropriate for our client base, and although I do appreciate the ESMA regulation could have a significant impact and you would like an answer as soon as possible, we want to make sure that all points are covered before a decision is made. It’s also worth noting that the ESMA statement above was a press release, and there will be additional documentation and granular details which as a business we will have to work through and adhere to.

 

The most important thing to note from a client relationship perspective is that all communications we have with you are accurate and informative, and whilst we will aim to communicate any changes as quickly as possible, we need to make sure they are compliant and suitable.

 

 

Switzerland or Australia?

Because I work for IG in London I can’t speak directly for our Swiss Bank or our Australian business. Although we obviously work under the IG brand, there are a couple of unique aspects to their processes that will be different to the UK (for example, they only offer CFDs). My understanding is that both businesses accept clients from outside Switzerland and Australia respectively. If you have queries about opening an account with these businesses, could I suggest you call them directly? Here is a link to our global website if you want to find out more.

 

 

A final note

IG Community was set up as an open and transparent forum for our clients to discuss market movements and trade ideas, submit questions and assist in any self-help you may require, as well as showcase new products and offerings from IG. Whilst we will continue to maintain that, we do have a set of guidelines in place which a couple of the above posts have broken. This specifically relates to the promotion of other providers.

 

Open discussion is important, and whilst I know the longer term Community users will agree that we generally don’t edit posts, I have had to go through and make a few amendments. In the context of this thread these posts also hint at circumnavigating a regulatory change, which when it comes into effect will legally require adherence. Can I therefore ask Community members to hold off on discussing these matters.

Sn
New Contributor
Posts: 2
Registered: ‎21-10-2016

Re: What do you think of the new ESMA proposals?

We could do with a non-IG forum to discuss these margins changes and our future options. It seriously affects the ability of many to continue their profitable trading. Any suggestions on other forums/means of discussion? Trade2win?

Regular Contributor
Posts: 206
Registered: ‎22-02-2018

Re: What do you think of the new ESMA proposals?

All they’re saying is don’t talk about companies which explicitly talk about getting around the law... seems fair.
Sn
New Contributor
Posts: 2
Registered: ‎21-10-2016

Re: What do you think of the new ESMA proposals?

Yes Pandaface, and don't talk about competitors, which is completely fair.

 

The point i was making was i think there'd be a benefit of us all discussing our options where we don't have such restrictions.

Occasional Contributor
Posts: 18
Registered: ‎18-01-2017

Re: What do you think of the new ESMA proposals?

JAMES

You write "we think ESMA will extend the time period for these rules at least a couple of times before national regulators like the FCA update their own rules to be more like ESMA’s new rules."

Will IG impose the new rules when  ESMA decides or when the FCA follows, which, according to the above, could be 6 months later? 

Frequent Contributor
Posts: 64
Registered: ‎08-03-2016

Re: What do you think of the new ESMA proposals?

"The temporary measures are to be reviewed by ESMA after three months to assess their impact. However, the FCA has already indicated that these measures may be permanently cemented into legislation in the UK at a later date."

 

https://www.reedsmith.com/en/perspectives/2018/04/esma-to-impose-restrictions-on-cfds-product-interv...

Frequent Contributor
Posts: 64
Registered: ‎08-03-2016

Re: What do you think of the new ESMA proposals?

from the link above

 

"This is known as the ‘qualitative test’ and is a subjective requirement. The client would also need to meet a ‘quantitative test’ by passing objective qualifications in order to be classified as an ‘elective professional’ "

 

subjective?

 

 

Community Manager
Posts: 1,154
Registered: ‎20-09-2016

Re: What do you think of the new ESMA proposals?

[ Edited ]

@straddle wrote:

JAMES

You write "we think ESMA will extend the time period for these rules at least a couple of times before national regulators like the FCA update their own rules to be more like ESMA’s new rules." Will IG impose the new rules when  ESMA decides or when the FCA follows, which, according to the above, could be 6 months later? 


As a speculative, non legal reply >>> Rules imposed by ESMA would require adherence. It wouldn't matter that the FCA could then take an additional 6 months (for arguments sake) to impose the same standard of ruling on a most domestic level.

 

Also note that we may apply rulings prior to this hard cut off date. We will make sure all clients are aware of this as soon as we have a firmer understanding which should be over the next few weeks as more details comes from ESMA.

Occasional Contributor
Posts: 12
Registered: ‎04-03-2016

Re: What do you think of the new ESMA proposals?

@JamesIG

 

Hello James, why would you be applying ruling changes prior to the hard cut off date when there has been such an over whelming response of rejection by your customers and the ig community?

Community Manager
Posts: 1,154
Registered: ‎20-09-2016

Re: What do you think of the new ESMA proposals?

hey @coolebenji - We have 185,000 clients trading millions of positions over 15,000 different markets, and there are plans (as you know) for significant changes in margin which in some cases can be up to 10x the current requirement. The best way to transition into changes as significant as these is gradually, not only from a market and credit risk management perspective, but also simple practicality. With a hard start day proposed it would be a poor business decision to leave it to the very last moment before making all these changes. 

Occasional Contributor
Posts: 12
Registered: ‎04-03-2016

Re: What do you think of the new ESMA proposals?

...just when l was getting my game together!  oh well as Jesse Livermore says:

 

"There is nothing new on Wall Street or in stock speculation. What has happened in the past will happen again, and again, and again. This is because human nature does not change, and it is human emotion, solidly build into human nature, that always gets in the way of human intelligence. Of this I am sure."

 

l feel l have seen it all before, 100 years before, there has always been leverage and there always will be... l am looking forward to the European Bureaucrats to push off now... Smiley Wink 

 

if you google why ,'why businesses fail' Fobes claim 8 out 10 businesses fail in their first 18 months, and google 'how many businesses survive after 10 years' then inc claims 96% fail... it seems the bureaucrats don't live in the real world with their college education and there cosy jobs... how many domestic industries can the European's wreck...

 

...note to self, l really shouldn't have an opinion... Smiley Wink

 

 

Frequent Visitor
Posts: 1
Registered: ‎23-09-2016

Re: What do you think of the new ESMA proposals?

FWIW  i'm thinking a visit to Morocco might help, and trade via VPS through there.  I've probably got it all wrong.  oh well  .  .  .

Frequent Contributor
Posts: 64
Registered: ‎08-03-2016

Re: What do you think of the new ESMA proposals?

any news about the changes?

 

i saw ETX will start with the margin close out rule by the end of may

Occasional Contributor
Posts: 22
Registered: ‎18-07-2017

Re: What do you think of the new ESMA proposals?

Nothing yet I’m afraid @Kodiak but it would be good to get something sorted on Monday
New Contributor
Posts: 4
Registered: 2 weeks ago

Re: What do you think of the new ESMA proposals?

Hello, I have done a little reading on this. I was originally, to dip my toe, risk about £3000 at around 2-3% per trade of that initial capital. Now am I correct in saying I can still risk the same monetary value (2-3% of £3000) but I will need more cash in my IG account? Therefor it will only cause a cash flow issue?

Community Manager
Posts: 1,154
Registered: ‎20-09-2016

Re: What do you think of the new ESMA proposals?

Hey - to confirm we will have 2 months from the official publication of the regulation (as currently it was only a notification of intent to change) and therefore we don't have a planned roll out for this. We are of course making provision and planning on the back end, but until we have an official statement and clear set of dates, we will be holding off. 

 

Please also note we now have a page on IG.com which may be of interest for some people https://www.ig.com/uk/professional-trading

Highlighted
Occasional Contributor
Posts: 5
Registered: ‎22-03-2018

Re: What do you think of the new ESMA proposals?

Well if you ask me the new ESMA proposals suck, only a few rich old timers probably favour it but for the majority of punters it's ridiculous.

 

The only thing which ESMA should have imposed is the negative balance protection as standard, this would have been more than enough to protect the retail traders but instead they're pushing the average Joe out of the game.

 

 

Frequent Visitor
Posts: 1
Registered: ‎17-02-2018

Re: What do you think of the new ESMA proposals?

The regulators are using a hammer to crack a nut as usual. The new rules have little relevance, it is effectively a ban on trading similar in the US, stopping traders will small accounts from trading. Everyone has to start somewhere.  The answer as someone has already mentioned, balance protection would have been the answer. 

 

Instead of targeting scam companies, they are targeting regulated brokers. The scammers will still be taking money off people despite their new rules!!