Is spread betting for fools?

[nit2wynit]

4 minutes ago, andysinclair said:

It sounds like you need an automated scanner to find such opportunities. IG Index has an API which can be used to build applications, if you can define the "rules" which identify such opportunities then a system could be built which could be constantly monitoring various markets and alert you when your rules are met.

I can't see how you could ever trade like this without some automated help.

Indeed.  It's been a long journey for it to finally sink in.  Spread Betting was never in my Action Plan.  I've tried to make it work and failed.  I've been trying to fit the round peg in the square hole for far too long.

I've no Idea what IG Index or API is so I'll look into it.  Thanks.

[nit2wynit]

In fact @Caseynotes I'll do my very best here to clear it all up for you in fine detail so we can avoid this moving forward.  It's repetitive.

I was as green as fresh grass when I started back in March, but what I had been studying was Breakouts, or more specifically, the Buying and Selling of Shares below £5 on News or a Catalyst, where I could trade in seconds or minutes and take profits of 1:1 or better.  where i would trade on the 1m 5m and buy the 1st pullback and sell the rise.  At the time I didn't know we had Spread betting in the UK, so as I discovered the Demo platforms of several of the UK providers, I put my time to working out how to use them.  My immediate goal was to understand the charts and the platform specifically.  After a good success rate on the Demo, I decided I needed to go Live to see the real world difference in time between placing a trade and exiting.  It is here where i lost my way.  I had abandoned my Trading Plan in lieu of proving success or recovering losses.  At the point you reference above, I hadn't realised that my strategy was not suitable to slow moving chart patterns that would go up and down, hence my Shallow Stops where I'd make profit and give it away again.  Still it took 3 weeks to lose £400, but you must understand it wasn't a simple case of me Losing EVERY trade.  I made back £250 in one day!, only to lose it all over the following week.   However, I left to Buy Pinterest shares at the point of being down £400.  I must stress that I was up and down in profit at this point, but on a downward trajectory.

I was not adhering to my Trading Plan as stated above; Finding and Trading Breakouts!  I was trying to apply the same principles to Spread Betting on Slow Moving Targets.  It didn't work.  At the point of me seeking advice, I had already lost £200 but couldn't figure out why.  This resulted in a downward spiraling fear that never left me.  The advice given wasn't how to trade Breakouts effectively, but how to manage a small account and apply it to Spread Betting. i.e small stake, larger stops.  But that was never my Goal!  

So when I say the advice I was given didn't suit my Goal, I hope you can see where I'm coming from.


Spread Betting hasn't beat me.  IG hasn't Beat Me.  I have failed to understand that trading breakouts on Small Cap stock, is very difficult with Spread Betting.  It's not rocket science!  But it has been a necessary learning curve.


The advice I've received here has been invaluable as I have stated in the the past and most recently, but it has never been the advice toward my Goal.  Day Trading Breakouts.

I have continued to try and adjust my Strategy to the likes of Indicies and FX, but I've not applied the necessary Stops etc. to make it work as it's never been my Goal.

I thank you again for your time and help but try not to take it so personally.  This is my journey and my story.  It's relevant to me only.  You have just been here to witness the ride.  It's not necessary for you to save/search/scour my posts for messages I posted about my own journey and experience, in order to validate your input.  Relax.  You're not on trail.


Can you show a real time stream of a Day Trade of small cap with a small account using IG and the Retail Platform?

If you can I could have done with the info back in April.  If you can't then you're giving me advice on how You trade, not how I and thousands of other people around the world want to.

 

[Caseynotes]

@nit2wynit, actually you put us on trial when you said you only started losing when you started taking advice from other forum users. You were losing money when you came onto the forum as your early posts show, you told us that you were literally throwing up because of the anxiety caused by the size of risk you were taking on with a such a small account (£170/point) and the advice was don't bet so big, simple so far but not the solution you were looking for as the goal was to learn how to earn a living trading off a small account there and then before you blew the account. And then your account blew up. That's more or less it.

[nit2wynit]

On 02/09/2019 at 00:29, dmedin said:

This sounds like a statement about society and life in general ... however ... there are plenty of people offering to let you into their members-only discussion forums or mailing lists for a fee.  Why anyone would pay such a fee without seeing clear evidence of the benefits of it is a mystery to me.

Did you ever look into Warrior Trading/Ross Cameron on YT?  (Among others.)  These people Find and Trade breakouts.  

He has thousands of students around the world and each day, Live on YT he talks you thru his Watchlist of Gappers etc.  Then the following Day, he does a recap of Gains or Losses.  Yeah it's about making money for him.  so what.  Everything is.  you go to work it's about selling your time to your employer; you have value and what you know or do has value.  Therefore in this world, sell your info.....

However, I've not been able to follow as the stocks he uses are not available with IG..!

[dmedin]

2 minutes ago, Caseynotes said:

actually you put us on trial when you said you only started losing when you started taking advice from other forum users.

Oh I didn't think he meant that

It's just that the SB approach is different from the method Americans use, where they are actually dealing in leveraged shares rather than derivatives.  (That can be enormously risky)

[nit2wynit]

7 minutes ago, Caseynotes said:

@nit2wynit, actually you put us on trial when you said you only started losing when you started taking advice from other forum users. You were losing money when you came onto the forum as your early posts show, you told us that you were literally throwing up because of the anxiety caused by the size of risk you were taking on with a such a small account (£170/point) and the advice was don't bet so big, simple so far but not the solution you were looking for as the goal was to learn how to earn a living trading off a small account there and then before you blew the account. And then your account blew up. That's more or less it.

**** me Casey........Take a **** break lad!

What do you think you know when you've asked no questions????

I know you're going for the 'Star Contributor Badge and Hat' ensemble but Jeeesus man........

I can't begin to explain the psychological preference for you to take what i say personally and now you're trying to get everyone else involved in it to back you up by suggesting i've put EVERYONE  on Trail.  Make your own case lad..  Try not to only pick out of the conversation that suits your personal grievance.

The advice given was never about Day Trading small Cap Stock.

Can you prove it?  End of!


Oh and @Caseynotes the £170 pp was the Demo... Guess you missed that detail in your quest to be Forum Champion!

Edited September 3, 2019 by nit2wynit

[nit2wynit]

2 minutes ago, dmedin said:

Oh I didn't think he meant that

It's just that the SB approach is different from the method Americans use, where they are actually dealing in leveraged shares rather than derivatives.  (That can be enormously risky)

Exactly!  Thanks for stepping in.  There's a bit of a 'I'll tell you what you meant, not understand what you meant' mentality going on here.

So fecking defensive.

[Caseynotes]

9 minutes ago, nit2wynit said:

Oh and @Caseynotes the £170 pp was the Demo... Guess you missed that detail in your quest to be Forum Champion!

oh ok, how much was it on the live account that was making you throw up, just curious.

[nit2wynit]

12 minutes ago, Caseynotes said:

oh ok, how much was it on the live account that was making you throw up, just curious.

I went live again about a month ago with £2k.  I noticed to the right of the screen that Uber was in trouble.  I brought up the chart to see it plummeting.  My ticket remembered my stop from the previous trade.  I got in as it was dropping;  FOMO, but hadn't adjusted my stop.  (if i had adjusted it I'd have made back my entire losses since March) I immediately lost £56 in a second.  It made me gag.  It made me gag because I did what I know what Not to do.  Then for the rest of the day I lost a total of £220.  I lost 1/8th of my account in one day chasing a Leprechaun.  

I haven't Blew my account.  I've got 10k for this if i could prove my wins with 2k.  I haven't, so I've pulled back with 1k left of my limit.  My total Learning costs were £2400 as this is what it was going to cost for me to join Warrior Trading.

You have no answers because you've asked zero questions.  If you assume everything by your own knowledge you'll never know anything more.  You need to ask more questions if you want to become enlightened.  Becoming enlightened takes time as one must digest information.  Learning is a process of time not knowledge.

However, as courteous as I am being, your sarcasm and amazing wit is still shining thru.

I have not lost more than £40 on any single trade, other than Uber.


 

Edited September 3, 2019 by nit2wynit

[Caseynotes]

25 minutes ago, nit2wynit said:

I went live again about a month ago with £2k

no, I was referring to your first live account, it's the constantly revised history I find difficult to follow.

[nit2wynit]

10 minutes ago, Caseynotes said:

no, I was referring to your first live account, it's the constantly revised history I find difficult to follow.

You're stuggling with info?  ask specific questions.

Started with 1400, lost 400.

stated with 2k lost 1k  

= -£1400 over 6 months.  Half of this amount was lost in 4 days not consecutive.

Tell me, does this info help you help me Day Trade Small Cap Breakouts with IG?


 

[Caseynotes]

45 minutes ago, nit2wynit said:

Tell me, does this info help you help me Day Trade Small Cap Breakouts with IG?

right yes, and welcome back by the way, it seems like only yesterday we said goodbye. I think we did talk about the DMA platform a while back but did you ever give it a try? It's only for cfd accounts but it does give you direct access to the market and you can see the level 2 depth of market data so you can see available liquidity in advance rather wait for the platform to respond, it's easy to move account balance across (I think you need £1000 in the cfd account) but costs nothing to download, I think the LSE exchange data feed is about £8/month but check, and you could see how it operates for a couple of weeks. I you didn't like it you could just move the money back.

https://www.ig.com/uk/l2-trading-platform

 

Edited September 3, 2019 by Caseynotes

[nit2wynit]

5 minutes ago, Caseynotes said:

right yes, and welcome back by the way, it seems like only yesterday we said goodbye.

Casey Casey Casey, my Dear Dear friend.

If you read my post back again and take note, you'll see I said I'm Leaving the Platform!  Not the Forum.

Yes we did briefly touch upon DMA L2 and MT4, but moving to CFD from SB has it's downside; Tax etc.

However, it's clear I need to change what I'm doing, or more specifically, the Platform or tools to Day Trade Small Cap Breakouts.

[nit2wynit]

2 minutes ago, TrendFollower said:

I am not the greatest trader and I accept that.

If you're in profit then you a better trader than I.  

You're right, I am Rigid on Day Trading, in the same way you are Rigid you are not!

AIM is limited on Spread betting.  I can't get access because of Spread or Un-availability.

This is my plight.  We're all repeating ourselves for the Likes I think.  I'm not here for Forum ticks.

I just want to know how to Day Trade Small Cap Breakouts (Or larger is I can afford them) using IG.

The other 6 months of 'Advice' hasn't helped me achieve this.

I don't need to know how to trade them.  I know how to trade them.  I even know how to trade the FTSE, but knowledge isn't the same as Action.  I've quit before I reach my absolute limit.



So If i can outline it here for hopefully the very last time.......................

How can I Day Trade ANY Cap Breakouts with IG and 1k?


Answers in depth below if you can advise.  Please, spell it out.

Thanks

[Caseynotes]

4 minutes ago, nit2wynit said:

However, it's clear I need to change what I'm doing, or more specifically, the Platform or tools to Day Trade Small Cap Breakouts.

That is the point, it's a different tool, you're not going through IG, you can see in advance if there is liquidity on the buy and sell side or not, and you are better off paying tax on profits than not paying tax on er no profits.

[nit2wynit]

Just now, Caseynotes said:

and you are better off paying tax on profits than not paying tax on er no profits.

I suppose so.............


So, if we can start....Again.


How do I Transition?  Where do I start?  Does IG offer all above?

Thanks.

[dmedin]

I was under the impression you have to qualify as a 'professional' client to get access to CFDs, and the requirement to be a 'professional' is insider knowledge and/or £500,000 balance.  And you can end up being in debt if it goes disastrously wrong.

[Caseynotes]

27 minutes ago, nit2wynit said:

How do I Transition?  Where do I start?  Does IG offer all above?

yes IG does it all, and you can use it for cfd or non leveraged share trading, have a look at the dma user manual pdf , check which exchange you want a feed from, see this page and the link to the shares dma page from there. If you don't like it it will have only cost you £8.

https://www.ig.com/uk/l2-trading-platform

there might be some youtube vids on it too, will need to search.

nb/ the professional requirement is only for forex trading.

 

Edited September 3, 2019 by Caseynotes

[Caseynotes]

1 hour ago, nit2wynit said:

How do I Transition?  Where do I start?  Does IG offer all above?

 

[dmedin]

Exciting! 

[nit2wynit]

11 minutes ago, Caseynotes said:

 

**** me it's complicated.  6 months down the line and this is the **** I should have been learning.

However, with this said, If i can find a reasonable price range that IG deal in that doesn't exclude the vast majority of shares on offer, I may still be able to do this with higher priced stock.

Case in point.  as the US opened..

Abeona Thera....
Emergent Bio....
Fastly.....
Conn's Inc....

All have potential to go again.

 

[nit2wynit]

My point with the above post and the Instruments is that those small few were the only one's i could trade on the US!  I went thru the A-Z to find anything that was on the move.  This is all i could trade!!

[Trevbeats]

On 13/01/2019 at 16:18, TheGuru12 said:

It took me a while to become ultimately profitable.

O please do tell your plan sir.

[Trevbeats]

4 hours ago, TrendFollower said:

@nit2wynit,

I am not the greatest trader and I accept that. I also accept there are many better traders than me who make far more profits than me. It is unlikely they will be using IG’s platform to trade. They will have an account with Goldman Sachs and the like which requires a bond of a couple of million pounds and it is those traders you want to follow and look for guidance. 

You will only find words and charts on IG Community and then more words but after the price has reacted which we can all see. I include myself in that. What you are looking for is someone to tell you how to trade but the problem you have got is that you have picked an asset which is small caps and decided to day trade and you seem to be rigid in this position. Trading requires flexibility and adaptability. Trade assets which are strongly trending. What if small caps are not strongly trending? Then what is your strategy as you want to day trade so you will become trigger happy which you want to avoid. Be patient and wait for the best opportunities and trade those. 

 

Loving the infor here. Can you give me some of your picks in Trading assets please?. I trade on the currencies and indices and gold.

[dmedin]

18 hours ago, nit2wynit said:

**** me it's complicated.  6 months down the line and this is the **** I should have been learning.

It's not really ... flip a coin, heads long, tails short ... same odds of being right as using all the TA in the world

[nit2wynit]

2 hours ago, dmedin said:

flip a coin, heads long, tails short

hahha

Did you manage to check out any of the Shares I posted yesterday?  Abeona Therapeutics specifically?  Great money to be made on that one.  I pulled £500 on the Demo with a 2k account.  Risking only £50.

Edited September 4, 2019 by nit2wynit

[dmedin]

3 hours ago, nit2wynit said:

hahha

Did you manage to check out any of the Shares I posted yesterday?  Abeona Therapeutics specifically?  Great money to be made on that one.  I pulled £500 on the Demo with a 2k account.  Risking only £50.

 

I've seen the demo account provide factually incorrect information - on Boeing - not sure if the FCA regulates this stuff but if it doesn't it should ... doubt it's top of their agenda now though, as we are just pond life to the City swindlers!

[nit2wynit]

32 minutes ago, dmedin said:

I've seen the demo account provide factually incorrect information

what do you mean as I'm currently taking a closer look at the Demo and the chart patterns.

However, on another note, tell me you took at look at my suggestions yesterday.  3 of them were winners for sure.

[dmedin]

Demo platform shows an enormous hanging man in July:

 

Live platform:

 

 

How can anyone justify trading the demo platform when it produces discrepancies of this magnitude?

If anyone replies saying 'Data is indicative' as if that is some kind of excuse for fraudulent practices

 

Edited September 4, 2019 by dmedin

[nit2wynit]

45 minutes ago, dmedin said:

How can anyone justify trading the demo platform when it produces discrepancies of this magnitude?

If anyone replies saying 'Data is indicative' as if that is some kind of excuse for fraudulent practices

Well.....there certainly is something up as i have seen this too....But the difference was between the Live chart on my Tablet and the Live chart on work PC.  The candles were different at specific points on the same Instrument, and Timeframe.  This made me realise that it was almost impossible for me to place tight stops and take small point moves, if the difference was so obvious that my trades could be failing before they've even begun.

I'm still querying with IG why the Retail Platform is so laggy my end.  They say I am literally the only person to mention it and to back this up, I've had no-one confirm it when i put the question to the forum.  So up to now it IS only me.

Today on the demo:

PL showing different on top right than what is showing on the chart.  Only one trade running.
Placed a trade but the Ticket detail didn't appear on the chart even after a refreshed, but did appear when I changed the Timeframe.  this has happened before on the Live chart and i missed profit because i wasn't able to quickly close the trade.  By the time i figured out i needed to open the Positions panel i had already lost it.

Trades couldn't Close when I click the Close button on the chart.  There was a spinning cog as if it was loading.  Even after refreshing it was still spinning, but in my positions it was gone.

I've had these same problems on the Live charts too, so it's not just the demo.  This is why I'm looking for another platform to try.  In the meantime I'm just looking for US breakout patterns and having a 'Punt'.

I'm starting to really think that although not admitted officially, Day Trading and Scalping is not supported and actively sabotaged.