Is spread betting for fools?

[nit2wynit]

I've never noticed this kind of thing before.  Anyone explain it please?  Been watching this for an hour.  Anticipating yet another drop, but could go either way again in my eyes.  the square candles at the end.  they are increasing as I type.

 

[nit2wynit]

Christ on on a bike.  that was a hard slog.  Can't do that everyday.  Slow moving Traffic.  Anyone have any better luck?

Made about £50 Gave about £16 back, up £34.  Happy but won't be doing it again in a hurry.  1 trade for the Day next time.  The move is probably coming on either of these but I'm worn out now.  Need to find a Pace.  I've applied some of the much give advice from you all, but clearly still playing a short game.  Back to my New Starting Balance last week.

Thanks again.

 

 

[nit2wynit]

I'm guessing it's no surprise to some of you how intrinsically linked the FTSE and German 30 appear to be?  If Only I'd realised sooner

 

[Caseynotes]

6 minutes ago, nit2wynit said:

Christ on on a bike.  that was a hard slog.  Can't do that everyday.  Slow moving Traffic.  Anyone have any better luck?

Made about £50 Gave about £16 back, up £34.  Happy but won't be doing it again in a hurry.  1 trade for the Day next time.  The move is probably coming on either of these but I'm worn out now.  Need to find a Pace.  I've applied some of the much give advice from you all, but clearly still playing a short game.  Back to my New Starting Balance last week.

Thanks again.

 

 

Not surprised it was a tough day, all the indices putting in a strong bull candle but just a quick tote sees you've shorted the indices 17 times and only longed 7 (as you say, a short game). 

It this like resistance training or something, you know where you train to sprint by dragging a big weight behind you? just asking. 

[Caseynotes]

1 minute ago, nit2wynit said:

I'm guessing it's no surprise to some of you how intrinsically linked the FTSE and German 30 appear to be?  If Only I'd realised sooner

 

yes, that's one of the reasons I've been posting side by side charts every morning for the last year and a half 🙂

[nit2wynit]

9 minutes ago, Caseynotes said:

It this like resistance training or something, you know where you train to sprint by dragging a big weight behind you? just asking. 

It's training of a sort.  Plotting in's and out's.  It doesn't really matter to me that much.  G30 going sideways on my chart since 12.30.  i thought it was going down.  Only broke out in the last hour to go up.  

I was there right at the bottom of the G30 very early this morning but didn't place the trade.

[nit2wynit]

For what it's worth, if I'd gone Long at 11am on G30 I'd have made £20 quid to this point.

 

[Caseynotes]

 

10 minutes ago, nit2wynit said:

For what it's worth, if I'd gone Long at 11am on G30 I'd have made £20 quid to this point.

not sure why you say that, has climbed over 50 points since 11:30 and is still over 30 points higher now.

This is Ger30 M5 I posted on the Dax and Dow thread a just a short while ago.

edit: from 11am went up over 85 points

 

Edited July 23, 2019 by Caseynotes

[nit2wynit]

7 minutes ago, Caseynotes said:

not sure why you say that, has climbed over 50 points since 11:30 and is still over 30 points higher now.

Sorry, i meant 12pm.  If you look at my trades I didn't see the G30 till about then.  i was watching the Russell...

I think shortly after I noticed your thread so got the charts up

Edited July 23, 2019 by nit2wynit

[Caseynotes]

1 minute ago, nit2wynit said:

Sorry, i meant 12pm.  If you look at my trades I didn't see the G30 till about then.

yes, dax had already hit R3 by 12pm.

[nit2wynit]

An insight since you asked is as I've mentioned before.  Somehow I've developed a desire for Reversals.  If i believe an R is coming, I'll go short at the high point on an uptrend and take profit at the bottom is the R doesn't arrive.
 

Disappointingly I gave in at the top there at 12532; I've even marked it on the chart  Went down Stairs to see it had dropped.  Managed £5 on the way down..  Long Day.

[Caseynotes]

8 minutes ago, nit2wynit said:

An insight since you asked is as I've mentioned before.  Somehow I've developed a desire for Reversals.  If i believe an R is coming, I'll go short at the high point on an uptrend and take profit at the bottom is the R doesn't arrive.
 

Disappointingly I gave in at the top there at 12532; I've even marked it on the chart  Went down Stairs to see it had dropped.  Managed £5 on the way down..  Long Day.

buying the dip is playing reversals of sorts, just not on the primary trend but the secondary trend (the pullback), less risk and higher probability.

 

[Caseynotes]

 

 

[nit2wynit]

Yep.  all that yesterday.

Gave back ALL profit this morning from yesterday.

i was in at the top but for the sake of £5 extra as a Stop I got Stopped out at the top.  Missed out on the overnight decent.  Then lost the rest at the 8am opening.

Everything I know I shouldn't do, I did.

[Caseynotes]

 

8 minutes ago, nit2wynit said:

Yep.  all that yesterday.

Gave back ALL profit this morning from yesterday.

i was in at the top but for the sake of £5 extra as a Stop I got Stopped out at the top.  Missed out on the overnight decent.  Then lost the rest at the 8am opening.

Everything I know I shouldn't do, I did.

the two most important attributes to develop and enhance are patience and discipline. 

[nit2wynit]

56 minutes ago, Caseynotes said:

the two most important attributes to develop and enhance are patience and discipline. 

Yesterday was all about those two thing for me and I believe I succeeded, right up to the point where I knew I'd over traded, anticipated a reversal too early, chased it for 5 hours, only to lose it all in the morning.  lol.

 

[Caseynotes]

1 minute ago, nit2wynit said:

Yesterday was all about those two thing for me and I believe I succeeded, right up to the point where I knew I'd over traded, anticipated a reversal too early, chased it for 5 hours, only to lose it all in the morning.  lol.

 

It's not unusual to watch a market pirouette around a level for hours on end before it suddenly takes off to a new level, actually that's how markets do work.

Contracts are being traded back and forth for long periods of time at the same level because the price is right.

It's the times of imbalance that you see movement and those are the times you are trying to capitalise on but you need to wait for them, they won't be forced. 

That's why breakouts and pullback based strategies are really all you have, the ones that can be used between levels. Trying to call the tops and bottoms is the main reason novice traders don't make it, proven time and time again. It can be done but it needs a whole set of different skills and an awful lot of experience. 

 

 

[nit2wynit]

11 minutes ago, Caseynotes said:

Trying to call the tops and bottoms is the main reason novice traders don't make it, proven time and time again. It can be done but it needs a whole set of different skills and an awful lot of experience. 

I hear that..........Down to 944 now.  Still trying to ride it.

Where is the G30 going?  i read you figured a retest, or return to Pivot.  I'm assuming the return to Pivot has already happened.  going up erratically.

Edited July 24, 2019 by nit2wynit

[Caseynotes]

18 minutes ago, nit2wynit said:

I hear that..........Down to 944 now.  Still trying to ride it.

Where is the G30 going?  i read you figured a retest, or return to Pivot.  I'm assuming the return to Pivot has already happened.  going up erratically.

Dax is holding station wanting to go higher but is waiting for Dow to make up it's mind, see dax and dow thread.

[dmedin]

[nit2wynit]

@dmedin @Caseynotes @TrendFollower @Foxy @davidbrister

Hello everyone.  I just wanted to pop in a say Good Bye; I'm leaving IG (The Platform).  Spread Betting has been a tough lesson for me since March.  I had a limit of -£1400, and yesterday I reached it.  My apologies for the frustration I have caused some of you.  My gratitude to all that have offered advice.  

It's clear to me that Spread Betting is Limited, especially with a small account.   In this I have indeed been a Fool and it's taken far to long to realise.   The inability to trade Small Cap stock for instance.  Today as I do most days, I searched thru the entire LSE for any stock on the move of 5% or more.  Of the thousands I scoured, maybe 10 were available to trade.  The rest of the time the market was only available to Close, or Unavailable to Open.  The reason for this of course is, according to IG; They do not meet out requirements.'  I can only assume that a heavily liquid market costs them too much.

Spread Betting is 'Free'; but comes at a cost.  In hindsight it all now makes sense. 

'Day Trading Small Cap Stock' was my Plan.  My Strategy was to find Gappers under £10 that had moved 5% or more pre-market.  Buy the 1st pull back and sell the rise.  It's not a new thing.  It's as old as trading itself.  I often found myself backed into a corner by some of you and I could never figure out why.  There are literally hundreds of thousands of people around the world trading Breakouts.  I got caught up in the emotion of it all.  The need to place a trade.  I was impatient, impulsive and basically Gambling.  However, when i first started, I made profit.  Not on the starting balance, but on my daily.  I could make anything from £5 to £100 in a matter of minutes with only £1000.  But I lost something.  Maybe it was courage, I'm not sure.  What is clear is I've done nothing but lose since I tried to play Long with a small account.  

The problem here with IG and Spread Betting, is the inability to either find Small Cap stock, or even Trade them when you do.

The big realisation is the poor retail platform, especially for me.  I've had no success in finding a solution to the laggy charts, missing data or close button, and even PL being different.  It's not great.  I've had zero technical support.  I have estimated I have lost almost £300 to frozen charts or missing Close buttons on the Chart.

I could go on, but it's of little importance.  I just wanted to sincerely thank you and I wish you all good luck with your trading.  I'm not quitting, but I am taking a break while I research other brokers and platforms.

Spread Betting may be on the way out.  It's certainly is for me.

Good Trading people.   

[Guest ChrisN]

Well at least an honest and a detailed explanation of your thoughts and observations.

IG must be/are the market leader in the UK. I say that because if your penchant is for small cap stocks then the first thing to realise is the sheer lack of volume/liquidity and hence the large spreads.  Data will be sporadic because of that. Applies equally to AIM equities. Personally I try to steer clear of such markets but I wish you luck trying to find them within the SB arena.

[nit2wynit]

1 minute ago, ChrisN said:

Personally I try to steer clear of such markets but I wish you luck trying to find them within the SB arena.

Yeah it's been a tough realisation.

I won't be returning to Spread Betting.  I'll be looking for Share Dealing.  Think i'll try investing too.

 

[dmedin]

41 minutes ago, nit2wynit said:

The need to place a trade.  I was impatient, impulsive and basically Gambling. 

 

Yes, I could be doing with a little goblin to sit on my shoulder and prod me before I place a trade and ask 'Do you really mean to do that?'

[dmedin]

1 minute ago, nit2wynit said:

I'll be looking for Share Dealing.  Think i'll try investing too.

 

 

Good idea

 

[nit2wynit]

8 minutes ago, ChrisN said:

IG must be/are the market leader in the UK

but they're not known to have the best platform.  It's terrible; for me at least and I've tried a few.  Not really sure why I settled with them actually.  It's never been good.

For instance I've been using Saxo.  it's amazing compared to this one.  

[nit2wynit]

Disappointingly and as per usual, I've just made £100 on the Demo FTSE drop lol.  £2pp

[nit2wynit]

5 minutes ago, TrendFollower said:

I have been Spread Betting in the UK for many years now and I am still here.

Yes, Trend; technically I am still here also.  £1400 isn't a lot of money,  but it is a Limit I have applied to my learning curve.  My Issue is not with SB, but how it's not transferable to Breakouts on small caps; i.e my business model.  I find the Retail platform with IG a problem also.  I may re-discover SB on another platform and trade Indicies only.  The FTSE for Instance.

Thanks

[dmedin]

1 hour ago, nit2wynit said:

Yes, Trend; technically I am still here also.  £1400 isn't a lot of money,  but it is a Limit I have applied to my learning curve.  My Issue is not with SB, but how it's not transferable to Breakouts on small caps; i.e my business model.  I find the Retail platform with IG a problem also.  I may re-discover SB on another platform and trade Indicies only.  The FTSE for Instance.

Thanks

 

I have a kind of toxic feeling in my head ... I think this might be addictive.

Losing large sums of money, with no hope of making it back, but keeping on doing it ...

Maybe it's wrong.

[nit2wynit]

2 hours ago, TrendFollower said:

Why not do it on indices on this platform? 

Trend, I'm not sure if you've tried other platforms.  The retail platform here is really bad for me.  I've commented on it since I joined back in March.  It's laggy, buggy, and I feel it's unreliable.

I've tried other platforms since and they are amazingly smooth and accurate.  I can only confirm there might be a problem with the 'New' platform as there are other instances since it went live going back a few years.  I've also conceded there may be an issue my end, but I've had no technical feedback from IG.  Hence my desire to look elsewhere.

My losses are to do with me alone.  But some are to do with the platform; or the problems I have directly related to it.

My learning is still active.  I was just lucky today finding the FTSE going down.  Too often i get in too early or at the wrong point.  But I can't go back to the demo; especially with IG.

On at least 3 other platforms i can drag the chart around in real time with zero lag.  I can't do this with IG.

Case in point; today I had a position open on the demo.  I had a stop at -£75.  I tried to move the chart around but it was lagging.  I accidentally moved the Stop position on the chart and created a Stop of -£150.  The minimum Stop was 12pts, so I had to wait for it to make sure it didn't drop further than my original stop.

Anyway.  I've left the Platform, not the forum, though I doubt I'll be adding much when i find a new one.

As a parting gift Trend, maybe you can offer a thought on what to do with only 1k?

Thanks